After More Than 16 Years, We Sat Down With Zach Downey, The Face of "Almost Politically Correct Redneck"

n Halloween night all the way back in 2003, Zach Downey, who was 30 years old at the time, arrived home from work and cut his hair into perhaps the most famous mullet to ever grace the internet in the span of just five minutes. As the seemingly insignificant photo began to spread online, it slowly morphed into the Advice Animals meme known as “Almost Politically Correct Redneck,” depicting Downey as an ignorant hillbilly who attempts to voice his opinion on various issues, only to miss the mark considerably. Now, over 16 years later since he snapped the image in 2003, Downey works as an immigration document technician for a university in Colorado where he lives with his wife. We managed to track him down and ask him about the meme, what he’s been up to and how he feels about being the face of a controversial meme format.

Q: Hey, Zach. Thanks for letting us have the chance to speak with you. So to kick things off, would you mind filling us in on what you’ve been up to lately, where you live and what you do for work?

A: I just moved in the last year from Indiana to Colorado following my wife's job out here. I am working for a university in international programs and my main job is to bring international students into the U.S. to study. I was at the Lilly Library for 10 years, and I worked for IU [Indiana University] libraries for 20 years and the last 10 were at the Lilly, which is a rare book and manuscript library. I was doing digitization there as digitization manager, so I took images and made scans of all sorts of rare books and manuscript items -- everything from Medieval manuscripts from thirteenth, fourteenth to fifteenth centuries all the way through to some modern stuff with authors like Kurt Vonnegut, people within the entertainment industry like Orson Welles -- I worked a lot of their original materials. So it was a lot of fun.

Q: Can you take us back to that day in 2003 when you cut your hair into the mullet and then snapped the photos? What was the Halloween costume and how did you come up with the idea?

A: So I had pretty long hair, definitely beyond my shoulders, and this was 2003. I'd been growing my hair out for quite a while and I was sick of it. I was ready to cut it, and it was getting close to Halloween and some friends of ours were looking forward to it. We decided to go out to a couple of bars and I thought, “I'll just turn my hair into a mullet.” So I went to Goodwill that week and tried to find a NASCAR T-shirt, but I could only find some sort of sprint car T-shirt. I bought that, and it must have been a Friday because I got home from work and in about five minutes gave myself the mullet in front of a mirror.

There was actually an early concert that evening. I went to see the Fruit Bats play as the mullet guy, which was a lot of fun. People were dressed up at that show and the Fruit Bats actually did a set as Led Zeppelin. So the mullet guy got to see Led Zeppelin on Halloween. Then we went to a couple of bars and stayed out pretty late and had a lot of fun at one of the bars, which is sort of a dive bar in Bloomington, Indiana called The Video Saloon. One of the bartenders said, “You know, you actually look like some of our early evening clientele.”

So I got up the next day and the plan all along was to just shave my head. I had saved the [hair] I cut off the evening before, and we saved what we cut off afterwards to send to Locks of Love. My friend Jen had been keeping her vintage GMC pickup truck in our yard and was like, “Let's take some pictures of the mullet in front of the pickup truck.” So we took maybe six or seven photos then. For the very last photo, I noticed that we had a straw bale and I said, “Let me grab a piece of straw.” I put [it] in my mouth and the photo that became the well-known photo is the last [one] of the mullet. The next photo in the files is me with a mohawk and then with a shaved head. So my wife took all the photos, and that's how that evening went down. It was a ton of fun. There were all sorts of photos. I think there are 34 photos total of the mullet from that 16-hour time [I had it].

Q: You mentioned that your plan all along was to donate your hair from the costume to Locks of Love. Can you tell us more about that and why it was important to you?

A: I've always been really lucky that I have a thick head of hair that grows very quickly. I think over the course of my life now I’ve donated six times to either Locks of Love or other charities that use donated hair to create wigs for folks who are undergoing cancer treatment and that sort of thing. So I always thought, “I'm blessed with it. It grows fast. I might as well help others when I can.” I have a lot of facial hair as well, and since moving to Colorado, I've even joined a beard and mustache club here. I actually won a contest for that a few months ago, but I don't know of any place that’s accepting donated beards.

Q: So how did the photos first appear online? Who posted them and where?

A: In the early 2000s, mullets had sort of regained some kinda popularity. Definitely in a sort of fun way -- not that people were really embracing it has a popular hairstyle. So there were several sites. There was Mullets.com, Mullets Galore. I don't know that any of them still exist. But my cousin Heidi said, “Oh my gosh. You know we've got to send your image to Mullets.com.” I don't recall if it was her that sent it or me, but it was definitely with my blessing. This was maybe a week after the mullet. I sent copies of it to all my friends and family and everyone loved it. So it was just a natural thing to sort of share it with the world. I think the day after I sent it to [them], someone from their website contacted me and said, “Hey we're gonna make you ‘Mullet of the Month’ for November 2003.” So they did, and for a couple of years while that website sort of thrived, it was great checking in every now and then seeing all the comments that people were leaving. Lots of people were really mean about it, but obviously [they] had no idea that this is a guy who worked in the library system and doesn’t really have a mullet. So yeah, that was its birth online.

(The original upload to Mullet.com)

Q: What was your initial reaction when you first noticed the photo taking off online? Do you remember when you first saw a meme using the image, or who showed it to you?

A: I can't remember who sent it to me, but one of my friends discovered it was a flyer for some sort of corporate barbecue picnic or something that they ran across on MySpace. They were using my image, and we just couldn't believe it. It was hilarious that someone had taken my image from Mullets.com and started using it for things. That was the first [example I saw], and I wish I had saved that, but I had no idea it was going to take off the way it did. There was [also] some site that created all of these fake album covers, and there's a band called “Chicken Coupe DeVille,” and they used my image as a fake album cover for this band. I don't know why, but that's one of the images that kept showing up. All my friends -- anytime they saw it, they would forward me a link. Early days it was MySpace that sort of propagated and spread [the image].

Q: At that time, did you know much about memes or was it only a result of you yourself being featured in one?

A: Definitely not. At that point in 2003, I personally wasn't really aware of meme culture. There were certainly some things that showed up repeatedly, but the concept of a meme was nothing I was familiar with. I had a MySpace profile, but I didn't use Facebook, and I still don't use Facebook. The mullet had a Facebook page, but I honestly haven't looked at it in a couple of years. I wasn't really on Twitter at all [either], so it was very limited in what friends would discover and send me links to outside of MySpace, which I wasn’t really active on either.

Q: As the image became solidified into the standard format of “Almost Politically Correct Redneck,” how did you feel being the face of something like that? Did you hate it, love it or just shrug it off?

A: Initially I was pretty excited, just because it was all over Reddit. A friend of mine sent me a link to Advice Animals on that sub, and initially I was quite thrilled. Then it slowly started to sink in that yes, [while] this meme is essentially trying to point out the ignorance of racist and homophobic ways of thinking, even though it's pointing out that that's bad -- it's still my image being used with essentially hate speech. You know? Lots of really horrible racial slurs and homophobic things. So after a while, this sort of novelty of it being a super popular meme wore off, and I got a little more bummed out about it. It's not like this was my livelihood or anything, it was just this fun thing that had been going on for years. But it definitely kind of bums me out that it is kind of a negative thing in some ways.

Q: As the meme continued to spread online, what were some of the reactions from close friends, family members or colleagues? Did they think it was funny, or were they upset by the use of your image?

A: Overall, everyone loves it. Among my friends, they just can't believe that they know the mullet guy. People are always excited to send me links to their favorites that they have of the meme. It's mostly positive. In fact, just recently my cousin tried to win some concert tickets to see Lizzo in a contest at this radio station in Indianapolis. [You had to] prove that you knew someone famous, so she used me, and I called and talked to the radio station. But yeah … she didn't win. Redneck mullet guy didn't carry enough weight to win Lizzo tickets. [laughs]

I've always been open about it with employers and co-workers, and everyone realizes that it's something that's out of my control. It's not like I'm printing posters of some of these memes and keeping them in my office or anything like that. And I don't look like that at all. I've had short hair now for several years, and even when my hair gets long, I'd never have the mullet. So it's easy to sort of distance myself from that. People are smart, and they know it's not me creating any of those.

Q: What’s your opinion of the Almost Politically Correct Redneck meme as a whole? Do you find it humorous or stupid?

A: They're always gonna be good ones and bad ones. Some people use it, and it's just stupid. But some people are saying poignant things about our society by using this sort of ignorant redneck who is apparently trying to be good, but he just doesn't quite realize that he's still saying things that are not acceptable. So I appreciate the intent, which is pointing out the ignorance of racist and homophobic ways of thinking, [and] I can appreciate that. For years, I did hold out hope that I could turn it into some sort of money-making [thing], but I don't know now that it has become Almost Politically Correct Redneck if that's really possible anymore. The sort of people who might want to use that image as a spokesperson are probably not products or organizations that I, personally, would want to be the spokesperson for. I have thought that if someone was able to spin it into some sort of YouTube video or anything [that] I could become the mullet guy and speak out against ignorant ways of thinking.

Q: The meme focuses on a character who is clueless about political correctness to a comical degree. In doing so, the captions used in the series often contain politically incorrect language that many find offensive. Could you see a meme like this going viral today?

A: Not as easily, [and] not in a mainstream way such as Bad Luck Brian. His is just so lighthearted and fun that even McDonald's contacted him for a sponsorship, and I really don't see that happening with the redneck mullet guy.

Q: When we interviewed Kyle Craven (Bad Luck Brian), he mentioned that he spoke with you about the meme and said you weren’t a fan. Has this changed at all now that it’s been so long since then?

A: Kyle and I were on a panel at PopCon 2014 in Indianapolis quite a few years ago. At that time, I was definitely more down on the negative aspects of my meme. It's not like I’m ok with the negative aspects of the meme now, but I've come around and accepted that overall it is trying to say something positive. But it still hurts a little bit that it's me being associated with all of that.

Q: In your career, you’ve worked with many college students over the years. Have any of them recognized you, or do you ever address your history with the meme?

A: Nobody has just looked at me and said, “Oh my gosh. Are you Almost Politically Correct Redneck?” Because I don't look like that guy. But it is almost always college students that once I say, “Hey, do you know who Almost Politically Correct Redneck is?” Or if I just show them the image, they're far more likely to say, “Yeah. I've seen that. I see that all the time.” [Rather] than people my own age or older. Some of the students are immediately thrilled, and they want to take their picture with me. They say, “Oh my gosh. A friend of mine sent me a birthday card and used your image on the card.” That sort of thing. So they seem to be excited about it more so than people my own age.

Q: Has the use of your image in the meme ever caused problems for you -- either with your career or personal life?

A: No. Definitely hasn't caused problems for me. Although, a friend of mine is a documentary filmmaker, and he wanted to make a documentary short about the meme, which is still something that might happen.

Q: If that does happen, you gotta let us know about that.

A: I would for sure. But this was maybe a little over a year and a half ago when I was still at the rare book library. They wanted to shoot some footage of me working in the library, but the library administration did not approve that. I'm sure the biggest part of that is -- the sort of “can of worms” that would have been opened by associating a rare book and manuscript library with Almost Politically Correct Redneck.

(Zach holding a Nobel prize at the Lilly Library)

Q: You mentioned having to bring it up to employers before. Can you tell me a little more about that?

A: I'm guessing that for the most part, no one would ever just sort of stumble onto that information. There are very few things out there that associate my real name with Almost Politically Correct Redneck. I think it would just be dumb luck for an employer to stumble upon that. When I got my new job here, I waited several weeks before I mentioned it to anybody. [laughs] It’s definitely not the sort of thing that [you bring] up during interviews. Entirely, it’s met with amusement. There's no one saying, “Oh. I wish we had known that before we hired you or allowed you to be a part of our club.”

Q: Does anyone else come up to you in public and recognize you as the face of Almost Politically Correct Redneck? What about the photo you found on the wall of a bar in Nashville?

A: Nobody has ever just randomly recognized me. If I've been out at a bar with a group of friends and had a few drinks -- feeling very social -- and we're talking with a group of people that I don't know, I will say, “Hey, has anyone seen this image before?” And I usually just show that image without any of the text on it. Depending on the age of the folks, it's maybe 50/50 at best. But when people do know it, they can't believe it. They just get so excited. They immediately want to take a picture with me and text a friend like, “Look who I just met.” And that sort of thing.

The thing with the photo in Nashville, actually it was a friend of mine [who found it]. It was maybe a year after the [original photo of the] mullet. So this is 2004. She was at a bar in Nashville and looked over on the wall, and there’s an 11×15-inch print of me framed on the wall of this bar. She took a picture and sent it to me.

(Zach's photo found on the wall of a bar in Nashville)

Q: That's pretty funny. I feel like it would be pretty surreal to see somebody you know on the wall of a random bar.

A: [laughs] It was so weird. We couldn't believe she had found that. Now it's been so long, I doubt she even remembers the name of the bar. I'd be really interested to know if it was still there.

I do have one other little story I meant to plug in earlier, which is one of the most bizarre encounters with the mullet. This is definitely before Almost Politically Correct Redneck. My wife and I went to North Carolina to see a Lambchop concert. We were looking for something to do, so my wife was looking online and there was this brewery called Pisgah [Brewing Company]. This brewery had a band that was playing, [and] the image they were using to promote the show was my mullet. We could not believe it. So, of course, that's what we did. We got there and the band hadn't arrived yet. So we talked with the bartender, and he said, “Oh yeah. It's our manager that creates all of those listings.” [Then] we talked to the manager, and he couldn't believe it. In fact, at first he didn't believe it. Usually what I have to do is make that face and sort of look to the side, maybe put a straw in my mouth or something. And he was like, “Oh my gosh! It is you!” So that was one of the more bizarre discoveries of the mullet photo.

Q: That’s funny. What was their reaction?

A: They were surprised, and I think they gave us a free beer. That was it.

Q: Is that the only free beer you've gotten so far from the image?

A: No. There was a brewery in Bloomington that briefly considered using me for some promotional stuff. During the meeting I had with their owner, he gave me a free six-pack just for meeting with them. So yeah, a grand total of seven free beers from the mullet.

Q: You've made quite a fortune off the image then right?

A: [laughs] Right? Yeah. I'm ready to retire.

Q: What are those interactions with people like over the years? Do you have any particular ones that stick out? What about the time you met Judah Friedlander?

A: Nothing really comes to mind as far as a weird reaction. I mean, it's always surprising I guess who among a group gets excited about it, but there's never been anything weird. I haven't acquired any stalkers or anything like that … yet.

Judah Friedlander came to Bloomington, Indiana and played at The Comedy Attic there. On that tour his sort of overall shtick was that he was the “world champion of everything.” He was the world champion of karate, making crepes, playing dice and everything. So afterwards, I waited around and I talked to him a little bit and I said, “You may be world champion of all of these other things, but I am definitely the world champion of the mullet.” And I showed him the picture and he laughed and said, “Well I think maybe we can both be world champion of the mullet.” So I agreed that he could share the title with me. My wife took a picture of the two of us together holding up our fingers because we're both number one. But he was very gracious in sharing the title with me.

Q: While some of the folks featured in notable memes have really embraced their involvement, you seemed to dislike yours. Why is this association negative for you and how does it differ from others who’ve taken advantage of theirs?

A: Because of the sort of negative language that's used with my mullet photo in the meme, I don't really feel connected to it in that way. Also, I'm a very progressive, liberal-thinking person and the sort of folks that embrace the ignorant sayings that the mullet guy [says] are just not me. So there's a weird disconnect there. I've had to ask several people in the past to stop using my image.

Q: We read that when the first images of you with the mullet went up online you lost the potential to have copyright protection. Do you regret that, and do you think you would have tried to capitalize on it otherwise?

A: I'm glad that this is a question you asked. I’ve worked in digital images and photography for many years, and I have friends who are photographers and friends who are attorneys. The bottom line is, if you're a photographer and you take a picture, you automatically are the copyright holder to that image. So, my wife is the copyright holder to that image [used in the meme]. We've never done anything legal to establish that because we can prove that it's our photo quite easily. My friends who are attorneys, they’ve talked specifically with copyright lawyers, and they've all said the same thing. Unless you are trying to fight someone and force them legally to stop using an image, there's no reason to really establish something on your own. So it's never really been anything I felt I needed to do.

I have been able to get people to stop using my image on CafePress. Because anyone can upload images to CafePress and open a store and start selling mugs and baby bibs and shirts. So I’ve had to ask CafePress to have people remove my image, because I have my own CafePress store. Honestly, as far as wanting to capitalize on it now, it's just never been important to me to do that. It would just take more time than I'm willing to put into it. I think before it became Almost Politically Correct Redneck, I really did have high hopes that I could do something with it. But now that it has this sort of baggage going along with it, I don't really think that's possible. If anyone reads the interview has some ideas, I'm definitely open to it. [laughs]

Q: More recently, we heard you were interested in revamping your role as “Mullet Man” depending on how the image was used. What’s made you have a change of heart relating to the meme and your association? Any plans to become the new mulleted-face behind a brand?

A: Well, like I said, it would just depend on the product or organization that wanted to use it. I originally had high hopes that maybe some sort of brewery would want to use me as a spokesperson. If nothing else … get some free beer every month. [laughs] But I think beyond just doing a commercial here or there at this point, I don't really have the time or energy to put into finding those things.

Q: In your free time, are you big on any particular social platforms or websites these days? Where do you spend your time online and what do you like to do?

A: I don't spend a whole lot of time online. I'm a big reader, so mostly there's a book in front of my face, but I do look at Reddit. It's mostly video-game related -- sort of pixel art, retro-looking games are what I'm into. Games like Spelunky, [which] is my favorite game of all-time. I look at people's runs that they post on Reddit. HydroHomies is a subreddit that I like. Moving to Colorado, I've had to start drinking water like I never thought I would. I'm constantly drinking water, and there's a pretty good sub called r/HydroHomies I like to look at. I pretty much stopped looking at Twitter after Trump won, just because it became a cesspool of negativity that I couldn't do anymore. I do have an Instagram that you might want to take a look at. It's kind of fun. My handle is @swatagnat, and essentially it's a project I started several years ago. I see hair ties everywhere on the ground, so I started taking pictures of them in a particular way. I have an Instagram that is entirely pictures of hair ties that I find. I don't spend a whole lot of time online because I sit in front of the computer for work all day, so I like to listen to music and read mostly.

Q: So if you could recommend one book and one album to Know Your Meme users, what would you say?

A: Okay. One book, I would say “Jitterbug Perfume” by Tom Robbins. One album, I would say. “Ease Down the Road” by Bonnie Prince Billy.

Q: Now that you’ve become more wise in the ways of memes, do you have any particular favorites? Any you loathe?

A: Well since I don't spend a whole lot of time online, I'm sure I'm not aware of the vast amount of them out there. But I do love Bad Luck Brian. It's so great. It makes me laugh almost every time. I’m a big Keanu Reeves fan, so Sad Keanu was a lot of fun, and I like Success Kid. I just think that's kind of funny. His mom was so driven to sort of capitalize on that. It's impressive how much effort she put into that. I think she was on Vine for many years. I was a huge fan of Vine and was very sad when that disappeared.

Q: What about Almost Politically Correct Redneck memes, any favorite versions?

A: That's tough because it always feels wrong -- laughing at any of them. So I hesitate to say any that are my faves, but the ones that are the best, I think, are the ones that don't use any directly horrible racial slurs or or anything. The ones that really make the redneck look like a complete dumbass are funny. In general, I just appreciate it when they can make the point that I think it’s ultimately trying to make, which is homophobia and racism is not cool.

Q: All said and done, if you could hop in a time machine and go back to that day in 2003, would you prevent yourself from donning the infamous mullet, or would you do it all over again knowing what transpired?

A: I would definitely do it again. If I could use that time machine and make myself maybe push it in a different direction before it became Almost Politically Correct Redneck, I would maybe do that. I am happy that it does still show up outside of Almost Politically Correct Redneck. The way recently that it shows up most often for me is “50 pictures that hilariously represent each state.” I'm usually always West Virginia. So it's a great image. I tell you what, if there's one regret that I have now, it's that once it became sort of popular and started spreading online, the image quality seems to just plummet quickly. If there's anything that really depresses me now, beyond the racism and homophobia, is that it's such a poor quality image that is being used. I've tried [to send] a better image to some of the meme generators, but no one has [responded]. It's a lost cause at this point I think. As someone who worked with digital images for many years, that really bums me out. [laughs]